Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder Support Group

A support group for those with OCPD and their loved ones.
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 Post subject: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 7:45 am 
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Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:13 am
Posts: 26
As some of you know I recently separated from my ocpd wife not sure 100% what the end outcome is but whatever happens happens and was wondering what's the most difficult thing to deal with for anybody who has a partner or relative ect who has ocpd?

For me with my wife is the whole denial I'm always right thing. She says I lied to her and I accept that and happy to admit I'm wrong, but she openly lied to me for years but she justifies it even though she made a mistake and not even said she's sorry.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 8:44 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:07 am
Posts: 987
I agree that the complete denial of any problem on their side is in the end the hardest issue. This denial is also completely "genuine" in that they honestly believe that this is the objective truth. It means that there will always be major gaps in the communication, a real difference in your 'common history' and a different take on all the crazy stuff happening in the relationship. Since the crazy stuff cannot be denied and since they are sure they are not to blame/the cause, all of the problems and craziness MUST by default be yours and any accusation or version of the truth differing from theirs is a lie or a sign of how deluded you are. Again, completely honest opinion, so you should be glad they actually put up with you.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 11:42 am 
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Joined: Thu May 08, 2014 11:05 am
Posts: 302
For me the most difficult thing is not really what my ocpd partner does but the impact that it has on me. Mine has the amazing ability to sniff out any moment when I am feeling truly free and relaxed - and squash it. So even if I hold firm, the moment - the relaxed feeling is gone. Anytime I have sort of reached for something new or different or outside of our normal bounds, he starts to pick it apart, so even if I have the courage to follow through, I feel isolated and discouraged. This has influenced me more than I care to admit and prevents me from pursuing things I might want to do.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 11:56 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 06, 2013 12:34 pm
Posts: 3
Both responses by belgianguy and wwurst are right on the money. Today is the day. I'm done and can't take any more of my ocpd_h (together 20 years). When I was told that I don't smile or laugh anymore I was honest. He sucks the joy from everything. It's exhausting to live up to his rules for order, detail and control. Every day from the moment he wakes up until he falls asleep, it seems his mission is to school me on the most proper, efficient ways of the world and how anything else is a sign of disrespect to him.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 5:10 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 08, 2014 11:05 am
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Walkandchewgum - GOOD FOR YOU!!!! I feel like I'm cheering on an escapee - go and get on with living life!


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2014 7:44 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 22, 2012 8:10 pm
Posts: 228
For me it was the complete lack of empathy and how mean, angry and abusive he could be at times. There was also the deep fog I was in trying to figure out what was going wrong all the time. It seemed in our case that only his feelings mattered. I still don't know what he knows about driving me away because we could never have an honest discussion. He would admit to others what he was doing, but never to me, it was always some kind of strange power struggle.

So sorry, that is more than one thing!


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 4:52 am 
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Joined: Thu May 01, 2014 8:33 am
Posts: 320
For me the most difficult thing is the total lack of third-person perspective from her. The inability for her to see anything from another person's point of view means that nothing can be resolved, because she is incapable of seeing that her behaviour causses such pain and destruction to them. The funny thing is, if I were to treat her the way she treats me she would go nuts. Yet she has no perception of her own behviour towards me and even when it is brought to her attention she can't see why she is in the wrong. Ok, that's 2 things, but the lack of self awareness is sort of linked to the lack of empathy.

The OCPDer is an epitome of the double-standard.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 10:41 am 
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Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 1:59 pm
Posts: 115
ThinIce wrote:
For me the most difficult thing is the total lack of third-person perspective from her. The inability for her to see anything from another person's point of view means that nothing can be resolved, because she is incapable of seeing that her behaviour causses such pain and destruction to them. The funny thing is, if I were to treat her the way she treats me she would go nuts. The OCPDer is an epitome of the double-standard.


I had a similar conversation with the ex bf in the end. I pointed out that if I spoke to him in the condescending manner in which he spoke to me he would have been long gone already. In the moment he paused for a long time taking what I said all in. I took it as a good sign, but now looking back though it may have registered something for him the overall self righteousness most likely over road anything he may have considered. After all he was always right and whatever he said and did towards me was deserved.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 11:43 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:40 am
Posts: 709
My ex was missing the anger, the abject controlling, the condescension, etc.

What I found most difficult were the contamination issues, and the crazy rules stemming from such. I believe he has both OCD and OCPD, and so he fears mold, and poison ivy, and to a lesser degree germs; and hates animal hair and crumbs and dirt. While he doesn't have repetitive compulsions like some with OCD, he has rules and protocols because of the OCPD. And these are rigid and hard lined and full of all of the maddening cognitive distortions.

I truly feel if he did not have the OCD, his OCPD would lie much lower on the spectrum. Or maybe that's not how to quite view it--I'm not sure I'm verbalizing it appropriately.

I feel for those of you who get the meanness and the rants and the super-controlling over where things go and how things "should be". That has to be so tough.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 12:45 pm 
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Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 9:56 pm
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hrh wrote:
My ex was missing the anger, the abject controlling, the condescension, etc.


Unless I'm confused, though, he showed a great deal of OCPD-style condescending contempt for us. The fact that he was capable of that left the very strong risk open that in time, it would be aimed at you and your daughter.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Sun May 25, 2014 12:55 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 15, 2013 7:40 am
Posts: 709
You are correct. I've very rarely seen anger and condescension aimed at others. Very rarely. We also had one verbal brawl early on. But this was not at all normative for him. I'm going with the average interaction, not the outlier. I can be judgemental and quick tempered, too, but it's not normative for me. If one gauges every relationship on only the outliers and extremes, then it's a whole other ball game.

He was a total a$$ when he was here. But he's rarely an a$$ in person. He is social and outgoing and while all my friends thought he was quirky, they also thought he was fun and helpful, etc.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 3:52 am 
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Posts: 987
Hi HRH,

I do not think that the high OCD 'causes' the high level of OCPD. I believe it would be more correct to think of a common cause of anxiety that can be relieved to some extent by OCD stuff and day hoarding and miserly living or extreme neatness (OCD). But the anxietycan also be relieved, and to a far more rewarding extent, by controlling others and by the feeling of superiority derived from knowing other people, even intelligent people, are still coming to stupid conclusions because they are not going as far in extreme logic, or extreme adherence to the Bible, or whatever, as they do.

It seems possible to believe that your relationship came to an end on his side because it became clear that the amount of control he would be able to exert over you was going to be limited. He may also have thought, with some reason, that the people on this board prevented you from accepting the controlled/controlling environment he proposed to you.

I do not have the feeling that your case was severe OCD and mild OCPD aggravated by the OCD, but rather the other way round, severe OCPD finding an outlet in bad OCD. You were quite valuable as potential sparring partner if in the end your 'defeat'/submission to his control was likely. Seems to me he cut his losses and then really showed his contempt to us that prevented his success. You were never really subject to his condescension, probably because he really admired your brains, but then you were never really under his control either and kept all power. Power given away, that is when the condescension creeps in. My ex rarely showed condescension towards others for many years; did so in the later years, enough so to realize that it was a complex minefield.

But hey, what do I know...


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 1:24 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 195
For me, the most difficult thing, the same way it was for many others here, was my BF's lack of self-awareness, empathy and a feeling of entitlement. He truly believed that his actions and words were not supposed to have any negative effect on me. If they did, he was ready to criticize and attack me to prove to me that I'm insecure, weak, irrational, stupid, flawed, etc. He told me himself that he never doubts himself, never regrets anything he says or does, never feels empathy for anyone else. He also was proud of the fact that if his partner feels hurt, he always tries to convince her to get "stronger" and not feel affected by anything... and for her to feel independent and not to expect any dependency on him.
OCPD is so complicated that all of those things had such a hurtful affect on me. But the unwillingness to take responsibility is far the worst...


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 6:17 pm 
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Joined: Fri May 16, 2014 1:59 pm
Posts: 115
puresage wrote:
For me, the most difficult thing, the same way it was for many others here, was my BF's lack of self-awareness, empathy and a feeling of entitlement. He truly believed that his actions and words were not supposed to have any negative effect on me. If they did, he was ready to criticize and attack me to prove to me that I'm insecure, weak, irrational, stupid, flawed, etc. He told me himself that he never doubts himself, never regrets anything he says or does, never feels empathy for anyone else. He also was proud of the fact that if his partner feels hurt, he always tries to convince her to get "stronger" and not feel affected by anything... and for her to feel independent and not to expect any dependency on him.
OCPD is so complicated that all of those things had such a hurtful affect on me. But the unwillingness to take responsibility is far the worst...


So .. I was married to a narcissist. . so much of this crosses over.
Bottom line. .call it what we want, you just described is terribly abusive.
You should commend yourself for having the strength to leave
Have you considered talking to a therapist? This type of thing is not easily worked out on your own.


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 Post subject: Re: What's the Most difficult thing to about ocpd partner
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 10:21 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 15, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 195
justme wrote:
So .. I was married to a narcissist. . so much of this crosses over.
Bottom line. .call it what we want, you just described is terribly abusive.
You should commend yourself for having the strength to leave
Have you considered talking to a therapist? This type of thing is not easily worked out on your own.


JustMe: I was with a narcissist for 4 years, and my mom was one too, so I really know how lack of empathy feels, and how subtly disordered people operate, the subtle lies, the denial of truth and your reality, the blame shifting and gaslighting, the endless crying and sadness... their inability to watch you being sad without attacking you even more... so the weaker you are, the more you should expect to be attacked, put down and ridiculed. I'm so shocked to be learning that the OCPD is so similar to that. The only difference that I see is HOW they use the same tactics. The NPD BF would get angry, threaten to leave the relationship, call me names, call me borderline and emotional and flirt with other women and have emotional affairs. The OCPD BF was more subtle. He would blame shift, but never express anger openly, so that I can't blame him for it (He used to say: "I always wanted to hurt and kill my ex-wife, but I had to practice self-control"). The OCPDBF would not threaten the relationship directly but rather behave in a way that would make me want to leave! He would a lot of silent treatment to manipulate me to behave the way he wanted. I still see NPD more intense just because they really want to punish you badly if you criticize them and they have no sense of morality and they can use people and use them. With OCPD's, they have a high sense of responsibility, and can be financially responsible, they can help you around the house (and be clean freaks!), and some of them have a high sense of morality and are fairly loyal.
But I'm tired of both!!!
Yes, I have a therapist I work with locally. I also do IFS (internal family systems) with someone over the phone in Seattle. I always work on myself, trying to heal, improve and grow... and always wish my partner would do the same... and so sad my OCPDBF would never do anything like that!


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