Obsessive-Compulsive Personality Disorder Support Group

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 Post subject: RT Lift-off...RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:45 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
I think my story is a combination of at least 2 of those I have read recently:
JustWant2BHappy & jujumonkey

I’m the wife of ocpdh. We have been married for 20+ years and together for 25. 2 teenage children, DS college freshman, DD15.

Currently I find myself very seriously contemplating divorce, having hardened my heart to ocpdh and having been found out having had an emotional affair (indescretion).

I say I am like jujumonkey in that I am ready to leave (but afraid and trying to figure HOW) at the same time still blaming myself (though to a lesser degree) and wondering how much is ME, my remaining feelings for my lost love, my imagination, my expectations...blah blah

I am like JustWant2BHappy in that I have in recent months found myself in an online/phone emotional indescretion and have been caught and confronted by ocpdh. The difference here is I have apologized – that I allowed it to happen. And that’s it. I have decided to forgive myself for being a human being and having needs. I have told ocpdh as much. As he continues to try to "forgive" me (and hang it over my head) I told him to tell whomever he wishes, if he thinks it would make him feel better, but that he MUST tell the truth (he has chosen to tell no one - I think he feels responsible and embarassed at how it would reflect on him). In addition, I have given him No access to my emails, texts, telephone, banking, etc. I need the privacy to communicate with my sister and friends and potentially my attorney, who, now that I have broken free of the isolation he has up until recently pushed me into (and I have blindly allowed over the years) are making up my support group.

(Some of) the backstory:
Over the course of our marriage, I have struggled with a feeling that things just weren’t ‘right’. Found ocpdh to be difficult and have tried over the years to protect him and keep him ‘put together’, while keeping the volitility in the household low(er). I hate confrontation, particularly the LOUD YELLING kind that comes with my ocpdh.

I primarily blamed myself (and allowed ocpdh to do so, as well). I thought I didn’t know how to be a good wife (my parents were divorced and ocpdh had told me so many times, it must be TRUE). I got to a breaking point about 2 years ago, having a major argument and being ready to walk out. Ocpdh spun it that I was “crazy” and potentially violent to me and to our CHILDREN, going thru menopause and finally he suggested I go to counseling after me suggesting it for us for many years. I went…looking back, opening my eyes, was the beginning of the upcoming, probable end.

I was able to realize that I am not crazy (stupid, inferior, insecure, thin skinned OR going thru menopause). It lead me to this board where your stories just HIT HOME.

There is so much more I want to share and hear your feedback/support, as well as chime in with my own experiences, as well, but I will stop for now.


Last edited by RikkiTikki on Fri Jun 24, 2016 10:00 am, edited 6 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 12:36 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
3 phases of marriage to a person with OCPD - from the book Fatal Flaws by Stuart Yudofsky

A. Idealization/courtship phase
• Recognition of spouse’s admirable personal qualities, such as intelligence, honesty, ambition, hard work and organizational skills
• Appreciation of spouse's performance orientation and vocational achievement
• Sharing of spouses scrupulous values and lofty goals for the future

B. Self-doubt phase
• Becoming challenged and unsettled by spouses unrealistic expectations
• Deepening anxiety and insecurity as a result of spouses unrelenting criticism and failure to express appreciation
• Isolation and loneliness as a result of spouses prioritization of work, accumulation of wealth and productivity over marital and family relationships
• Diminution of self-esteem as the result of having to give in to spouse on each occasion when there is a difference of opinion
• Becoming fatigued and demoralized by spouses' endless task driven demands and refusal to permit fun and leisure
• Deflation and depression resulting from feeling unappreciated and unloved

C. Enlightenment/disappointment phase
• Recognition that spouse will never be satisfied with himself or with her
• Realization that spouse is rigid, oppositional, controlling and withholding
• Awareness that spouse is cold, insensitive, sadistic and unloving
• Frustration that spouse refuses to acknowledge personal problems, try to change or accept professional help
• Understanding and acceptance that spouse is selfish and self-centered
• Concern and fear that decision to marry spouse may have been a big mistake

I'm posting this as it best summarizes what I have gone through and where I currently find myself.
I am still struggling with being hard-hearted in light that my ocpdh does show some inkling of understanding - reading book, Too Perfect, a few sessions of MC and professes to love me and want to stay together forever (unless that's not going to work for me - in which case let's get moving toward divorce. As long as we're moving and not just being unproductive.) LOL

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:49 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 07, 2010 12:17 pm
Posts: 1935
Location: SoCal - 5 yrs moved out/4 1/2 yrs broken up w/6 year live-in with OCPD b-f.
Welcome, Rikki-T. Yes, very familiar story. I would say that the excerpt from Fatal Flaws is spot-on, EXCEPT I don't believe those with ocpd are truly cold, sadistic, or unloving. I believe they care, very deeply, but the care that they may feel (on the inside) does not often translate to the care the partner needs on the outside.

I also don't believe it's selfishness or self-centered - that's Narcissism, although the effect from the outside may look and feel the same. It's more that those with ocpd don't seem to have "theory of mind" - they don't get that we are separate people with our own likes, dislikes, wants and needs. Therefore, if THEY like rare hamburgers, so do you. If they know something, so do you.

_________________
And the day came when the risk to remain tight in a bud was more painful than the risk it took to blossom. – Anaïs Nin
Follow the latest Scoop: http://www.scoop.it/t/iso-mental-health-wellness
OCPD SO info: http://perfectlyawfulusa.blogspot.com


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 2:59 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2014 7:40 am
Posts: 123
Wow you almost copied my story!
I am at the same point, feeling driven away from my ocpdw but guilty for looking elsewhere for companionship of any sort. I have also come to the realization that she will not change. Oh sure she can Hoover at times and, I would say not behave badly rather than behave lovingly. To most, even the kids, at times she's been clearly wacko and my "role" has been the rudder, the reason, the protector of the constant stream of whack-a-mole anxiety, rules and hypercontrol that has eroded her relationship with our kids, family, and friends and me isolated as collateral damage. But as the spouse we support them through their problems until one day in some way the ah-ha moment hits where you know it's them not you and you've been insidiously drawn in.

So the question for me, and probably you, is can I make a better life at this point without her and all the mess (emotional, financial, kid) that entails, or with her thereby not having a true partner but a full life other than her? I have a 7 yo which makes it a bit messier. Yes I've seen she has hacked into my email, tried to in my phone, etc. and changed her passwords for everything. Even if I'm talking w friends and family I don't want her to see all the emails and texts. I have several emails she doesn't know about, and I know she has one I "don't know about".
MC has not really helped for us.

Of course we will make our decisions because we have become integrated into supporting their behavior and are the scapegoat. So I feel the weight of this decision on me completely, and know if I leave the teens will be fine and really get it, if not immediately in the near future. A friend of mine said, as an adult if you knew your patent was miserable in a marriage would you want them to stay? That hit me hard in its wisdom, but pulling the trigger on the marriage has been hard enough I haven't been able to do it yet.


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2014 4:00 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
Thank you so much for your replies!

LovethatOCPDMan: I would agree with your exclusions. I don't think there is a 'malicious' intent but an obliviousness that someone has feelings, thoughts, desires that are different than his. End result is still a feeling of being taken advantage of. 2 recent examples I have are: 1. sincere anger? that I and the kids have not yet read a book that he suggested and that I DARE read one I had selected for myself. 2. I have been working for 8 weeks on a a "couch to 5K" program and when I let him know I had just completed it (feeling GREAT about myself) he said, "How can I be happy for you? I have been telling you for a year about using the treadmill and you finally do it using an iPhone app to motivate yourself". WHAT?

Almostdone: I have just come from IC where I told her that if it were not for DD I would already be gone. She seemed surprised. I guess participating in MC would lead her to believe I wanted to "fix" things. For a time I have been trying to be 'sure'. Sure it isn't my inability to understand a relationship (because I am a child of divorce). Sure I'm not just imagining the problems, because there are no bruises. Sure he won't completely fall apart without me there to keep him from coming unglued (this was the primary reason for MC, to get him some help). Sure that my feelings for another have not clouded my view of reality (turns out that that this is what allowed me to see clearly all that I have been missing and how I've been mistreated). So at this point, I'm 'sure', but I just don't know HOW. He is stubbornly stating that he WILL NOT move out, even though his parents only live 2 streets away and have extra room. He suggests me leaving, getting an apartment, even living with HIS parents. Seriously? My EIP (Emotional Indiscretion Partner) LOL - better known as an old and dear friend, has stated that I know what things will look like if I stay -My answer: I will continue to be unhappy and mistreated, modeling that life as OK to my children, and crushing my soul. The unknown life that awaits if I leave has the possibility of unlimited happiness. You mention emotional difficulty of separation, but we know the emotional cost of living with ocpd. (Of course I'm still afraid, but working toward overcoming that.) :)

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:38 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:01 am
Posts: 776
Location: Europe
Hi RikkiTikki, nice handle. I am one of those who has left. Actually over 5 years now. My story is here: sugar-s-saga-t577.html
It may be that you are hesitant because you're not quite ready to call it quits. From the other side, I can see that my firm determination to see through a divorce is something that I value, now. Otherwise, it's too easy to go back (which makes a later attempt to leave even harder) or to - later - deal with the uncertainty that comes if/when your ex gets back into his "A. Idealization/courtship phase" perhaps with a new partner. It's important to be able to deal with a lot of cr*p from your OCPDH, so you need to be physically strong too. And I would highly recommend that you see a lawyer. It's about feeling secure in your case if you know your rights. Find out if/how you can get your H to leave, if that's the decision you end up making.

_________________
Sugar
March 2009 - Ended 22-year relationship with undiagnosed exOCPDH
December 2009 - Met my wonderful partner (non-OCPD)


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:49 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:01 am
Posts: 776
Location: Europe
RikkiTikki wrote:
For a time I have been trying to be 'sure'. Sure it isn't my inability to understand a relationship (because I am a child of divorce). Sure I'm not just imagining the problems, because there are no bruises. Sure he won't completely fall apart without me there to keep him from coming unglued (this was the primary reason for MC, to get him some help)....

Just in case you are in any doubt: your H is an adult who has responsibility for his own happiness. Let me repeat, your H is an adult who has responsibility for his own happiness. If he falls apart, that is NOT your fault and you can't fix him. If he blames you, that does not mean that you must accept blame. The person you have responsibility towards is yourself. I found it very useful while negotiating my financial and physical separation to consider my OWN integrity and what I would be satisfied with offering this other person who was, and would continue to be, the father of my children. But treating a person according to one's own ideas of decency is very different from being manipulated by the "threat" of him/her falling apart. I turned it often round in my head to "Would I think this was reasonable if the tables were turned?".

_________________
Sugar
March 2009 - Ended 22-year relationship with undiagnosed exOCPDH
December 2009 - Met my wonderful partner (non-OCPD)


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:10 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
Sugar,

Thank you, thank you! I have just finished reading your 'saga' and it was so helpful. I'm currently in the bizarre circumstance of ocpdh having just read "Too Perfect". He is somewhat aware and acknowledging that he has *some* of the tendencies talked about in the book. He says that he doesn't have a problem, and now that I'm feeling done with MC, I don't think he will continue on his own...but I haven't expected a LOT of the things that have happened during the last 5 months of my life.

I have begun to be able to spot the cycles, but have never experienced 'hoovering', at least not to this degree. Now here's where the self-doubt "crazy" after years of thinking "it’s me" start to creep in... Could he really change? Can he change enough to have me be "in-love" ever again? I have had a few talks with my dd15 and I know she “kind-of” understands that I am not happy and that Dad and I aren’t getting along, but I’m concerned that she can’t grasp why these seeming little things are so hurtful to me. (After all I went along with most all of it for 20+ years – her entire lifetime). The therapist says he "seems open to change" from the little she knows of him (only 4 MC sessions + what I have said in IC). She says labels (OCPD) are not helpful, nor adressing his perfectionist tendencies head on - REALLY? Was I just supposed to wait for him to trip over them? I bought the book, began reading it and left it in the bathroom, using the Cammer test as a bookmark. I knew he would not be able to resist.

But now, the therapist has told me it would take at least a year to determine IF our marriage might be salvagable – WHAT? I should just continue along in limbo? Hoping for or pushing his possible change; waiting to see IF he can forgive me for my Emotional Indescretion (or losing the chance to be with the other who may very well be my soulmate); trying to regain respect or love for ocpdh – who may only be able to love me back in his way? Or would me letting down my defense walls just enable me to go back to protecting, fixing, excusing and pushing down my own feelings and self-worth. He tells me he doesn't want either of us to go back to who/where we were. I can’t tell if my resistance is self-preservation or feelings for another or just being so hurt that I am done.

I love the idea of chronicling ‘my story’ in one place as you have. It is thanks to journalling that I am able to see that these issues existed LONG before I reconnected with my dear old friend. So I believe that being able to go back and look at this process will allow me to think things through clearly, with the help of you folks. And to ‘make sure’ for myself and my children – and to a degree my ocpdh, that I have indeed tried my best (without breaking myself again) to make the best possible decision.

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:14 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 26, 2009 2:01 am
Posts: 776
Location: Europe
You're very welcome, glad to be of some help. I was in limbo for a year. You will find your way. Everybody has advice, but at the end of the day, you have to live with yourself. You know your situation best.

With regards to your daughter, it's tricky. You're responsible for her, but you also need to be in good physical and emotional health youself, in order to have the energy to be a good mother. Take on your oxygen mask before helping others with theirs, etc. I'm not saying that you should disregard your daughter, just that she doesn't need to understand or even agree to the decisions that you are trying to make. You don't need water-tight explanations; it is enough that you feel the way you feel. I remember repeating to my then 14 yo daughter, "I don't love your father anymore. I won't stay with someone that I don't love".

RikkiTikki wrote:
I can’t tell if my resistance is self-preservation or feelings for another or just being so hurt that I am done.

My guess is self-preservation. Been there, done that.

_________________
Sugar
March 2009 - Ended 22-year relationship with undiagnosed exOCPDH
December 2009 - Met my wonderful partner (non-OCPD)


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2011 4:07 am
Posts: 979
RT,

Couple of points. It gets worse over time. You are NOT being the person who you really are. You have the escape route ready: how will you feel in a couple of years if you have left this escape opportunity pass you by? You stay in prison voluntarily once; how will you get out afterwards?

He is 'somewhat like the book' and your therapist does not believe in labels. Well, the label ocpd does not help the ocpd'er for sure, but it helps us non's to no longer doubt our own sanity.

The only possible and relevant change is full awareness, written down and sealed and admitted to and committed to treatment. No less...

And yes, the grass really is greener over here...


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…
PostPosted: Fri Sep 05, 2014 8:02 pm 
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Joined: Wed Oct 31, 2012 9:09 am
Posts: 1083
Rikki Tikki ,
It is the same old story but it is your story and it is unique. The validation you will receive for the life you have found yourself living ,through the many and varied voices on this forum, can be enlightening.It unites us in sharing how it goes for us as we try to find our way through loving someone who has a disorder and provides insight into OCPD thought patterns by folks willing to share .Don't minimize it RT, it is real and we all get what you live each day.
Fast forward yourself, I am guessing 15 years and it is me coming to the same realization but so much later in life.I love my husband madly but I can not live with him any longer after 35 years with no children. I can not imagine keeping track of the effects of this disorder on anyone else but me. Keep reading and sharing as you find your way.
I made the mistake of losing myself to his disorder and through therapy discovered what was really happening in my life.It is a long hard road out of this rabbit hole and there are many paths to take. The strength and energy to do this hard work , is coming your way.gs


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Sun Sep 07, 2014 12:03 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
RikkiTikki’s Chronicle:
I’m the wife of ocpdh. We have been married for 20+ years and together for 25. 2 teenage children, DS college freshman, DD15.

DH (ocpdh) and I met at college. I am 2 years older than he. I was not interested in a relationship, but found him attractive and sweet, also reliable and persistent. Looking back, with the help of my therapist, I also found him to be devoted, someone who wouldn’t stray. My parents had divorced when I was in my mid-teens and there was a significant amount of infidelity on my father’s part over the course of many years. So, we dated exclusively for 2 years, were engaged for 2 and then married. During that time we argued about me being late, not being able to do much with friends, etc. but I thought he was worth the trade-off. I didn’t have a terrific relationship with my parents, primarily due to their divorce and the burden it placed on me (caregiving of my younger sibling, emotional support of my mother and difficulty forgiving my father). I became closer to ocpdh’s family and had also moved away from my hometown, leaving me with no friends, either. I had many concerns about living up to his parents’ standards of cleanliness, cooking, hard work, etc. I told him I could not and was not even interested to have those kinds of standards and that if he couldn’t live with me, he needed to tell me…he didn’t. I guess he thought he could, or that I could change.

We married, and I moved into the apartment he had been living in. The demands of keeping house began immediately. He always wanted me to clean when he wasn’t home, so it didn’t interfere with us spending time together. I fudged my way through it and did the cleaning, exercising, living on his schedule, even though I was commuting hours more than he and sometimes falling asleep at work. All the time thankful that he was such a hard worker and wanted to be with me so much.

We bought a home and after a few years wanted to have a child. Because he was so anxious to find out if I was pregnant, I took a test and found out that I was. We called family and friends, only to have to call them back with terrible news of a miscarriage, all within the first month. He was distraught and I was sad and a little worried myself. Somehow, he made me feel that I was uncaring (like something was wrong with me) because I took it as the doctor explained it, the body’s way of making sure a healthy baby would develop. I supported him through his doubts, never noticing that he wasn’t fully there for me, emotionally – or even particularly concerned for my physical health. A few months later, I was pregnant, again and we had DS. I still worked full-time, took care of the finances, things inside the house and most childcare, working from home a great deal. Ocpdh did share the childcare, due to a retail schedule that allowed him to be home when I went to the office a few days. During all of these years, I also made more money than ocpdh. We continued to argue about the cleaning/cooking standards.

Also, this is when the complaining about his varied bosses became more noticeable. His work was like a roller-coaster. If things were good, everyone was riding high, if not, everything was terrible. He was being used, overlooked, treated poorly. Most bosses were incompetent a**holes. It was about this time when I suggested therapy the first time. He balked, saying it was for weak people who were too lazy to try hard enough to work through their own problems, even though my parents had insisted that I go during their divorce (so these criticisms meant ME). So, of course, WE didn’t go.

A few years later DD was born and things continued on, with him getting promoted and working hard, still complaining about the upper management. My family was pretty much marginalized and I really had ‘no time’ for new friends or hobbies. He reminded me how busy I was working, taking care of 2 children, etc. so that’s pretty much ALL that we did. We continued to argue about the household stuff, except More, because we built a much larger home and now we added parenting into the mix of things I wasn’t as good as he is, due to my own lacking childhood. He complained that I never planned anything (why would/how could I) it would just be dismissed, criticized or ‘tweaked’ to meet his point of view. (He to kids & I, where would you like to go out to eat? 2 or 3 suggestions from me and kids, comments from ocpdh that we can’t make a decision (like a shell game, he would choose somewhere else, or one of the places we had suggested he didn’t like, or whatever…) but he would never just choose to begin with, even though that’s how it always ended up.

All of this continues on for the next 20 years or so…

I threatened to leave on a number of occasions, but really felt I had nowhere to go, because of the void in my family. The holidays were always a fiasco, he not wanting to invite my mother, but giving in and then pointing out how she always ‘tainted’ the occasion in some way. Also, holidays are busy in retail, so I would handle almost all shopping, all wrapping, cards, baking (which I loved) and my job, which also picked up at the end of the year. All to a stringent set of rules - must be equal number of gifts, equal dollar amount spent, often with him buying for one and me having to even things out. This went for my 2 nephews, as well as my children. Also, this wrapping and preparing was expected to be completed when he was working or sleeping or whatever, so that it didn’t cut into our time together.

To address the ‘together time’, that consists of me listening to him rant about his day, his a**hole bosses, co-workers, subordinates, their schedules and how they have modified them and how that changes his (never I work, on x days at y times – why do you have to write that down? Why do you have to make lists? Just try to be more organized…I digress), or watching what he wants on TV, usually flipping between stations and irritated if I’m reading a book (especially one he did not recommend), on my phone or iPad, definitely not in another room, irritated if I’m folding laundry, cutting coupons, I digress, again!)

Next part will be a fast forward to the present

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:01 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
Well, not quite the present...about 7 years ago, things changed drastically regarding ocpdh’s career. He was part of a merger and promoted. I took a pay cut and changed jobs to be closer to home and more available for childrens’ needs and school schedules. He was making significantly more money and had more responsiblilty and time constraints. Unfortunately, this position was short-lived and he was offered a step back and an unreasonable commute or severance. I said at the time (and have been reminded MANY times over the years – always saying how great it was that I said that, but now I’m wondering if it has helped him not feel guilty about the decision) that it was not up to me to make that decision. I couldn’t ask him to take the step back. He (we) chose for him to take the severance. He was out of work for 3 months (of hell), refused to apply for unemployment benefits on principle and took the first job that came up. During that time and the ensuing year of working in a demeaning, low paying, long commute of a job I approached him about the possibility of him being depressed, I almost went to counseling ‘for’ him, then realized it wouldn’t really help. This is when a lot of the angriness intensified, the world was out to get him, the economy was never going to recover, the downward spiral was going full speed.

I talked with my boss, who was working on his marriage and he recommended “The Love Dare”. I journalled and talked to my estranged father about being a better wife. I read online blogs about marriage and how to be a supportive wife, all the time being told from ocpdh that I was not one. If I encouraged him in his job hunt he said I was criticizing him and pressuring him. If I didn’t ask enough about leads or interviews he said I didn’t care and wasn’t helping. It was no win and I had no one (I thought – because he was so humiliated he refused for me to speak to his family, let alone mine) to talk to. Once, as I waited for my children to get on the schoolbus, I got into a conversation with a recently divorced male neighbor. He talked about counseling that he andhis wife had attended and I asked for a name. So much unhappiness came spilling out. He and I talked for over an hour, standing in the driveway. I didn’t realize how much I needed to talk. Unfortunately, ocpdh and I had argued that morning and he had called my cellphone and then my office. They hadn’t heard from me so he became frantic, calling the police and his father to see if they could check on me. I called him back and he calmed down, but has all but stopped speaking to the neighbor. In addition he has continued to bring that up over the years about “what I have done to him”, “how I humiliated him”, “how a real man would not allow that conversation to occur, unless he was interested in me” and recently, shouting when we were outside and other neighbors would hear how I probably had an affair with “Firstname Lastname”. I have really PAID for that conversation, believe me. It didn’t get us into counseling, however.

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 3:33 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
About 2 years ago, during the dark holiday months, we had a family gathering that had included my mother. She left, only saying Goodbye to me, not ocpdh or the children, who were downstairs. She does this, off and on – suffice to say, there are issues here, but when you know what to expect, your kind of roll with it. The usual after party, during cleanup conversation ensued, summarizing how the guests had “behaved”, particularly my family. He told me that he would have a right to tell me that my mother was no longer welcome in our house. When I became angry, stating that I was the one who did ALL of the cooking and preparation AND that the house was ½ mine, he certainly DID NOT have that right, he said he wasn’t SAYING that, just that he woud be within his rights. I again stated that he DID NOT have that right. I am an adult and he could not dictate that. The heated argument continued with me grabbing valuables and packing a bag. He pursued me to my closet and then into his, where the extra credit cards were stored. As I packed he continued badgering me about my mother’s bad behavior over the years. At one point I shouted at him, “What can I do about HER behavior?”. I pointed at the gun he keeps for ??? self defense and said “What do you want me to do, kill her?” – Yes wrong, angry and cornered…he called my children who had come into the room when they heard arguing and said I was saying I was going to kill my mother, their grandmother. Devastating. I grabbed what I had gathered and left, with the kids (young teens) wailing after me. I drove to a parking lot and sobbed for a long time. I was texting my children that I would come back. I calmed down and went home. I have PAID for that outburst many times over, as well. He convinced the kids (and me to a degree) that it was menopause. His mom ‘went crazy’ about that time (and I witnessed some of that when we were dating). He suggested that I go for therapy as I had been suggesting for us for years.

I went into the therapy, basically thinking I needed marriage help and wanted to figure out why I felt confident and secure everywhere but at home. I was off-kilter and feeling like I was going crazy. Getting things off my chest helped a lot. She suggested that I should look into ‘obsessive personalities’, but I thought she might mean me as much as ocpdh. After a few sessions, and the prodding about what we were talking about and did I really think it was worthwhile, I thought he could come along. I had commented that I was not sure how helpful it had been after only 3 sessions (big mistake). I was panicked the day of the appointment, that he would feel ambushed and betrayed. The therapist reassured me that she had never been accused of that and would be very open to listening to his point of view. My recollection is that he sat with his arms folded and his winter coat on for the entire appointment. We talked about DS and his study habits and our worries of getting him prepared for college. Not much about our marriage at all. Still, even on that safe topic, ocpdh was able to discern that she was MY counselor and only listening to my side and after days of “discussing” convinced me that I was being selfish concentrating on only my feelings when we had children to raise and a house to keep… I stopped going.

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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 Post subject: Re: I’m new, but same old story…RikkiTikki's Chronicle
PostPosted: Mon Sep 08, 2014 4:17 pm 
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Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2014 1:09 pm
Posts: 2315
During the past year, we have been visiting colleges with DS and helping him to decide where he wanted/could afford to go and get prepared. All of the financial aid has been handled by me, with ocpdh just pressuring and checking up, but never assisting. DS has a girlfriend whose parents are recently divorced, and there is considerable drama there. Ocpdh has obsessed about details of DS school, his job – not enough hours, schedule, asking to use a vehicle each and every time and having to call each time he arrives at his destination, stating what time he will be home – even if out with DS-GF parents and little to no control over that, obsessed about prom, been vocally critical about GF and her parents to DS. I have told ocpdh more times than I can count that DS may never want to come home to visit if he didn’t lighten up. DD15 has managed to fly under the radar during much of this, but she has tried to be peacekeeper and has even given me ‘advice’ on handling her father so that he didn’t become upset.

Around April of this year, I innocently reconnected with an old boyfriend on an online social media site. We had not dated exclusively, but he had meant a great deal to me. This was a person I had thought of many times over the years, particularly when times were very bad with ocpdh. We began a friendly online conversation of catching up on 25+ years of life. He was twice divorced and has 2 children. We fell into easy “conversation” which was one of the things we had shared so many years ago. It quickly turned to fondness. We had the opportunity to express what we had never said so long ago and enjoyed the ‘miracle’ of having that chance, so many never do. We were both overcome that we were both one another’s “one who got away” and that we had both so often thought of each other to help us through tough times in our marriages. I began to remember how it felt to be loved.

In June, we went on our annual family vacation. Things were strained between ocpdh and me. I found myself looking at him through a different prism and wondered if it was because of my feelings for another. At one point, while we were sitting at the pool (and me admittedly feeling a little self-conscious in my swimsuit) ocpdh asked – can I tell you something? I was thinking he was going to tell me something nice about my appearance – there are a few parts he usually enjoys looking at – but NO he tells me that the gray in my hair is really noticible!! I reply that there are SOME men who find me sexy! Boy did that one backfire! He wanted to know who. Was someone at work coming on to me? Incessant questioning. The next day, we visited an amusement park. I wanted to stop to take a photo, the 3 didn’t hear me and continued walking a few yards before they realized I wasn’t with them. I snapped the picture and ran to catch up. Ocpdh started yelling at me in the middle of the amusement park for taking a photo. Ranting that if I would JUST LISTEN TO HIM AND DO WHAT HE SAYS… I turned and started to walk away. That was it…the lightbulb moment. And for my children I turned back around and rejoined the family.

When we came back from vacation, I restarted therapy, without telling ocpdh.

_________________
RikkiTikki, 23 yrs married. July 2014 aware of OCPD, Sept 2016 divorced
XH=non-diag OCPD (Narc?) DS=21, DD=18
RL - Rekindled Love, BF from 20's Back in life

The beginning: rt-lift-off-rikkitikki-s-chronicle-t5072-2775.html


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